I received an FOI response from FCC on the Tilbury site and their intention is to use the site for a housing development. Unsure on number of units, but confirmed allocation is divided 62.5% affordable and 37.5% social. I understand it’s at pre planning stage so there remains time for the community to object. I’ve raised with Donabate Portrane Community Council but they haven’t responded yet. As far as I’m aware there has been no consultation by councillors. They seem to be hoping to slip it in under the radar. I put a post about it on one of their facebooks, simply asking for their views, and it was swiftly deleted.
It is my view that FCC see Donabate as a dumping ground to make up the numbers for the current Government. All well and good if the critical infrastructure is in place to support 1000s of new people, but we’re sold empty promises all the time and consistently don’t deliver.
Wouldn’t it be great to have a stand-alone community hub on this land instead. It’s in a central location and is accessible. A multi functional arts, cultural, youth and supports centre would be ideal and is badly needed. It’s in the plans since 2016.
It’s also worth noting this site is next to Lanestown, which is fully social and cost rental, while it’s also in front of Ballymastone, which has plans for 480 affordable and social units. Thats a worryingly high number of lower cost or social housing units in very close proximity. A walk through many areas provides evidence of what will become of this section of Donabate if this isn’t successfully opposed by the community.
I’m not sure what avenues we can take but would appreciate suggestions.
Thanks,
Graham
Tilbury site, New Rd (FCC owned)
Hi Graham,
I would not waste my time with the Donabate Portrane Community Council or our two elected Councillor, they are all in the pocket of the Minister for Housing.
Although DPCC has a chair person, the one who really runs DPCC was formerly employed by A&L Goodbody as a lobbyist and who has good connections with FCC (see attached). He is now employed by the Land Development Agency,. the same agency who buy land for affordable , low cost and social housing.
I know a local group has been formed to put forward a proposal regarding the use of the Tilberry site for a Community Hub but I do not have any info as to their progress.. I know however our two ELECTED Councillors are against a plan for turning Tilberry into a Community Hub
I would not waste my time with the Donabate Portrane Community Council or our two elected Councillor, they are all in the pocket of the Minister for Housing.
Although DPCC has a chair person, the one who really runs DPCC was formerly employed by A&L Goodbody as a lobbyist and who has good connections with FCC (see attached). He is now employed by the Land Development Agency,. the same agency who buy land for affordable , low cost and social housing.
I know a local group has been formed to put forward a proposal regarding the use of the Tilberry site for a Community Hub but I do not have any info as to their progress.. I know however our two ELECTED Councillors are against a plan for turning Tilberry into a Community Hub
Seems extraordinary to me in an election year that the two Councillors who are currently sitting would be against this. They'd need to start actually doing something positive for the community instead of just repeating what FCC posts. Had heard that about the Community Council that's a shame the previous crew had done a good job and put a lot of effort in. A community hub would be brilliant not everyone wants just sports hubs!
Yes Beenthere,
I do think the previous crew did a good job in getting the JR on Corballis East .What they did wrong was not to bring the community with them regarding the JR on Ballymastone. They decided to put the JR in place without a public meeting.
So there was a lot of anger in the Community mainly orchestrated, by sports clubs on the peninsula.
DPCC was therefore forced to withdraw the JR on Ballymastone mainly due to pressure brought on them and their families..
It is all hearsay I know, but I have heard the employers of a previous DPCC officer were contacted and pressure was put on him to resign from DPCC. Families with young children were verbally abused at local sports clubs, wives of members of DPCC were also verbally abused in public. .
These people said ....most of the pressure came from members of one party .... I will let you guess which one.
It is all out there, you just need to talk to anyone in the know in Donabate/Portrane and they will tell you the same stories.
""A community hub would be brilliant not everyone wants just sports hubs!""
Sports hubs are important to someone, ""It was a strategy devised years ago"" I have heard some members of this party say ....
Only guessing I know, ......... But It is important so they can brainwash members to vote for their Councillor.
If our Councillors did their job years ago when FCC was drawing up the LAP We would not be in the position we are in now.
I do think the previous crew did a good job in getting the JR on Corballis East .What they did wrong was not to bring the community with them regarding the JR on Ballymastone. They decided to put the JR in place without a public meeting.
So there was a lot of anger in the Community mainly orchestrated, by sports clubs on the peninsula.
DPCC was therefore forced to withdraw the JR on Ballymastone mainly due to pressure brought on them and their families..
It is all hearsay I know, but I have heard the employers of a previous DPCC officer were contacted and pressure was put on him to resign from DPCC. Families with young children were verbally abused at local sports clubs, wives of members of DPCC were also verbally abused in public. .
These people said ....most of the pressure came from members of one party .... I will let you guess which one.
It is all out there, you just need to talk to anyone in the know in Donabate/Portrane and they will tell you the same stories.
""A community hub would be brilliant not everyone wants just sports hubs!""
Sports hubs are important to someone, ""It was a strategy devised years ago"" I have heard some members of this party say ....
Only guessing I know, ......... But It is important so they can brainwash members to vote for their Councillor.
If our Councillors did their job years ago when FCC was drawing up the LAP We would not be in the position we are in now.
Thanks for engaging on this important matter.
The community needs so much more (community centres, shops, restaurants, crèches etc.) before further residential developments go up. It defies logic to use one of the last remaining central sites, Tilbury, for anything other than a site for basic services.
It’s clear the two councillors currently elected don’t serve the majority of people in the community and have other motives. Interesting that it was sports groups (the proposed campus looks excellent but let’s see if it’s delivered as set out) that objected most vocally and our councillor is heavily involved with them. I know he objected to the JR. I know there are many other worthy issues that residents have raised and they oppose. Location of Aldi and Beverton gate to name two very recent examples.
It would be good to get the message out there to other members of the community before they start knocking on the door bragging about works on the five-year delayed greenway commencing. I know many have plenty of grievances but sometimes a reminder of a what they have delivered / failed to deliver is necessary. If the DPCC isn’t the answer, what is?
@Mo - I couldn’t find a link to open your attachment?
The community needs so much more (community centres, shops, restaurants, crèches etc.) before further residential developments go up. It defies logic to use one of the last remaining central sites, Tilbury, for anything other than a site for basic services.
It’s clear the two councillors currently elected don’t serve the majority of people in the community and have other motives. Interesting that it was sports groups (the proposed campus looks excellent but let’s see if it’s delivered as set out) that objected most vocally and our councillor is heavily involved with them. I know he objected to the JR. I know there are many other worthy issues that residents have raised and they oppose. Location of Aldi and Beverton gate to name two very recent examples.
It would be good to get the message out there to other members of the community before they start knocking on the door bragging about works on the five-year delayed greenway commencing. I know many have plenty of grievances but sometimes a reminder of a what they have delivered / failed to deliver is necessary. If the DPCC isn’t the answer, what is?
@Mo - I couldn’t find a link to open your attachment?
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Mr. Stupid
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Social and affordable housing is necessary but it also needs to work and scale. Middle income people who can't qualify for affordable or social housing are priced out of Donabate and going further North. That's just making a dysfunctional market even more dysfunctional.
The hope for all parents living in Donabate is that their children can move to Donabate and affordable / social housing is heralded by our councillors as a pathway towards this. It’s the carrot councillors constantly dangle when pushing for more housing here. It buys them a pass with many in the community and takes away their focus from the inadequate services and facilities in place.
The harsh reality is people raised in Donabate have little to no chance of getting one of these units, given affordable housing is a lottery for which anyone can apply as long as they meet the criteria, while the next person / family on the FCC social housing list, or those in most urgent need, are offered the available accommodation.
I think that should be known by all, but the process isn’t transparent and the truth is regularly blurred to suit the objective, which is to push more devlopments on us. It has worked and we’ve been passive standers-by for the most part.
I do understand the need for more housing given the crisis this country faces. I saved for too many years to be in a position to afford a deposit, all while renting for more than my mortgage, and am a homeowner just over a year. I have absolutely no issue with new developments as long as there is adequate services and facilities in place in advance of developments being approved.
We have a very low age profile but I have no idea how people will be able to raise their children here in Donabate. The current situation is only getting worse. 20,000 people here by 2030. Double the population. We already have no crèche places available, no school places available, no after school services, doctors have not accepted new patients in years, no arts, culture, youth centre etc. The list goes on and on.
It’s clear as day we don’t have what’s desperately needed for a town to successfully function, and FCC are now planning to use the Tilbury site, one of the last remaining central sites and a strategic location bang in the middle of Ballymastone and Corballis, for yet more housing instead of trying to fix any of the above issues. It’s incompetence at best..
The harsh reality is people raised in Donabate have little to no chance of getting one of these units, given affordable housing is a lottery for which anyone can apply as long as they meet the criteria, while the next person / family on the FCC social housing list, or those in most urgent need, are offered the available accommodation.
I think that should be known by all, but the process isn’t transparent and the truth is regularly blurred to suit the objective, which is to push more devlopments on us. It has worked and we’ve been passive standers-by for the most part.
I do understand the need for more housing given the crisis this country faces. I saved for too many years to be in a position to afford a deposit, all while renting for more than my mortgage, and am a homeowner just over a year. I have absolutely no issue with new developments as long as there is adequate services and facilities in place in advance of developments being approved.
We have a very low age profile but I have no idea how people will be able to raise their children here in Donabate. The current situation is only getting worse. 20,000 people here by 2030. Double the population. We already have no crèche places available, no school places available, no after school services, doctors have not accepted new patients in years, no arts, culture, youth centre etc. The list goes on and on.
It’s clear as day we don’t have what’s desperately needed for a town to successfully function, and FCC are now planning to use the Tilbury site, one of the last remaining central sites and a strategic location bang in the middle of Ballymastone and Corballis, for yet more housing instead of trying to fix any of the above issues. It’s incompetence at best..
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Mr. Stupid
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Have faith.
Donabate is one of the few places in FIngal to have three schools right the heard of the community and another two a 5 minute walk.
It has a few great sport clubs and one the best beaches and public parks in Dublin. It could do with a few more shops but think you need more people living here to make it more economically viable.
Bad news can spread much faster than good news and that's just life. You can hear people give out some aspect of the secondary school but not hear as much about the student who got 8A1's there last year and that it provides a range of sports: Football, GAA, Basketball and some Tennis which is pretty good considering you are not even paying anything. Some of these teams I believe are doing really well.
They also put out a Rugby team and played a few matches every year, It's also mixed and non-denominal. The subject choice is also better than a private school. and for ninety percent of the kids going, it's a ten minute walk.. There's also a parents committee that people can join - and since it's all local it's easier.
Donabate is one of the few places in FIngal to have three schools right the heard of the community and another two a 5 minute walk.
It has a few great sport clubs and one the best beaches and public parks in Dublin. It could do with a few more shops but think you need more people living here to make it more economically viable.
Bad news can spread much faster than good news and that's just life. You can hear people give out some aspect of the secondary school but not hear as much about the student who got 8A1's there last year and that it provides a range of sports: Football, GAA, Basketball and some Tennis which is pretty good considering you are not even paying anything. Some of these teams I believe are doing really well.
They also put out a Rugby team and played a few matches every year, It's also mixed and non-denominal. The subject choice is also better than a private school. and for ninety percent of the kids going, it's a ten minute walk.. There's also a parents committee that people can join - and since it's all local it's easier.
So not long back from the draft framework event in DPCC. First of all, folks in FCC were very engaging and listened to all concerns, which is key to the consultation process. They even agreed that the Tilbury site should be used for a multi purpose centre rather than more housing.
I now urge everyone to include the need for the Tilbury site to be used for a multi purpose centre in their submission on the framework. Even though it’s outside the boundary line, I was told by FCC that the more people that take this opportunity to raise their preference for the Tilbury site, the more likely it is for it to be agreed to. They will assess all feedback and recommendations will be put forward to the chair. At the moment it’s earmarked for social and affordable housing. We knew that already, but it was confirmed again tonight.
On our councillors in respect of Tilbury site being used for a residential development:
Adrian Henchy - no objections made at any council meeting. Suggests he’s in favour.
Paul Mulville - raised an objection at latest council meeting. Proposed a standalone multi purpose centre. He has changed his stance so keep applying pressure on him and others. It works.
Corina Johnson - in favour of a standalone multi purpose centre.
Eoin Dockrell - in favour of a standalone multi purpose centre.
Local elections are soon. Now is the time for change.
I now urge everyone to include the need for the Tilbury site to be used for a multi purpose centre in their submission on the framework. Even though it’s outside the boundary line, I was told by FCC that the more people that take this opportunity to raise their preference for the Tilbury site, the more likely it is for it to be agreed to. They will assess all feedback and recommendations will be put forward to the chair. At the moment it’s earmarked for social and affordable housing. We knew that already, but it was confirmed again tonight.
On our councillors in respect of Tilbury site being used for a residential development:
Adrian Henchy - no objections made at any council meeting. Suggests he’s in favour.
Paul Mulville - raised an objection at latest council meeting. Proposed a standalone multi purpose centre. He has changed his stance so keep applying pressure on him and others. It works.
Corina Johnson - in favour of a standalone multi purpose centre.
Eoin Dockrell - in favour of a standalone multi purpose centre.
Local elections are soon. Now is the time for change.
Re Mr Stupid comments..
Just says it all... Everything is centred around sports .. This was the strategy employed by a local Councillor years ago so he could brainwash the members of GAA, Hockey and Football Clubs.
What if you are a teenager or someone not interested in sports ? My children were not interested in either. My Wife or I had to drive them to Malahide and further for their dance, music and acting activities.
Local elections are soon... Now is the time for change..
Graham, Maybe we should adopt "" Local elections are soon... Now is the time for change "" as our slogan..
Just says it all... Everything is centred around sports .. This was the strategy employed by a local Councillor years ago so he could brainwash the members of GAA, Hockey and Football Clubs.
What if you are a teenager or someone not interested in sports ? My children were not interested in either. My Wife or I had to drive them to Malahide and further for their dance, music and acting activities.
Local elections are soon... Now is the time for change..
Graham, Maybe we should adopt "" Local elections are soon... Now is the time for change "" as our slogan..
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Mr. Stupid
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Mo Kapav, great points. We need some music, art and drama.
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DonabateLad
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Looks like Paul Mulville introduced a motion at Council at the last meeting https://fb.watch/rt1RhGN3US/. Illuminating to see who voted against. https://imgur.com/a/L5pNQc6 Besides the obvious disappointing local abstention it's worrying to see Labour not voting as a bloc on this... I thought Duncan Smith was in favour of the campaign... you would think he would have a word with the councillors.
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DonabateLad
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You can see in the link I posted above.
Adrian Henchy abstianed (no surprise).
But Labour councillors Brian McDonagh and Brendan Ryan (retired from the Dáil but was co-opted onto the Council https://www.fingal.ie/news/cllr-brendan ... ty-council) abstained and James Humphreys voted against. I would expect them to vote as a bloc seeing as Duncan Smith seems to support the campaign.
Eoghan Dockrell is just a candidate atm but his one Fine Gael colleague at the meeting, Tom O'Leary, voted against the motion.
Thanks for that. Well FG did themselves zero favours there. I'm going to email Corina or Duncan for clarification on that because that seems very strange. All the noises coming from Corina and Duncan have been very pro that project. In fact if I remember correctly I went to that meeting about DP crossroads and they were 100% behind it. I followed it quite closely because my children would be very interested in it.DonabateLad wrote: ↑15 Apr 2024, 19:34You can see in the link I posted above.
Adrian Henchy abstianed (no surprise).
But Labour councillors Brian McDonagh and Brendan Ryan (retired from the Dáil but was co-opted onto the Council https://www.fingal.ie/news/cllr-brendan ... ty-council) abstained and James Humphreys voted against. I would expect them to vote as a bloc seeing as Duncan Smith seems to support the campaign.
Eoghan Dockrell is just a candidate atm but his one Fine Gael colleague at the meeting, Tom O'Leary, voted against the motion.
Hi - This is DP Crossroads just giving our view on the recent discussion at FCC regarding the Tilbury Site (Monday 8th April).
The first thing to say is that we were very disappointed that FCC decided to take a section 179a on this important site. By doing this they took away the rights of the ordinary resident to make a submission on the planning and also the rights of the Councilors to have any input into the plans (this is exactly what this legislation is designed to do).
In advance of our meeting, we wrote to all Councilors noting that we knew they couldn't do much about this section 179a development, but asking them to outline our concerns regarding another housing development in Donabate/Portrane without any real supporting infrastructure.
The motion was not a typical Council motion in that any vote taken would be 'ultra-vires' meaning acting beyond your legal authority. Any vote taken on the issue was not going to count for anything or have any impact on Council plans. That's why some councilors who support our group abstained or voted no - it wasn't going to alter FCC management plans.
However, what was important to us was that the motions (3 in total, tabled by Lab/FF/SD) were debated and discussed for 2 hours. It is almost unheard of for an ultra vires motion to take up so much council time and shows that our campaign has resonated with the Councilors. Most of them are angry that this legislation takes away their powers as local government but a lot of them are listening to us and see that we are concerned about excessive development without supporting infrastructure. They agree its not sustainable and this development of 175 houses + a small creche is just adding to the problem.
That said, we found a small number of Councilor's (all from the one party) comments about being '"either for housing or against it" and "anti-housing'" most disingenuous. The argument is more nuanced that that; Why would you double the size of the population and wait YEARS before putting the supporting facilities in? What reasonable person wants that? To be very clear, our group is pro-housing; pro- housing IN TANDEM with proper supporting community infrastructure. We are actively campaigning for a Cultural & Youth Center but we also support calls for other much needed community facilities - schools, childcare, health and retail facilities and will support any campaigns for these services.
Our argument is that we need FCC to allocate a site for this community facility now - before all FCC land is built upon. We have met with the Council senior management, made submissions in respect of the Urban Framework and have now submitted a detailed business plan to FCC management. We have a scheduled meeting in early May to discuss the business case and push to take this project forward. In the meantime, we will continue with our campaign and ask everyone in the community to get behind us.
I'm attaching our latest newsletter with details of our activities - we post frequently on social media so please like & share to get the word out to everyone and to keep up to date with our activities.
The first thing to say is that we were very disappointed that FCC decided to take a section 179a on this important site. By doing this they took away the rights of the ordinary resident to make a submission on the planning and also the rights of the Councilors to have any input into the plans (this is exactly what this legislation is designed to do).
In advance of our meeting, we wrote to all Councilors noting that we knew they couldn't do much about this section 179a development, but asking them to outline our concerns regarding another housing development in Donabate/Portrane without any real supporting infrastructure.
The motion was not a typical Council motion in that any vote taken would be 'ultra-vires' meaning acting beyond your legal authority. Any vote taken on the issue was not going to count for anything or have any impact on Council plans. That's why some councilors who support our group abstained or voted no - it wasn't going to alter FCC management plans.
However, what was important to us was that the motions (3 in total, tabled by Lab/FF/SD) were debated and discussed for 2 hours. It is almost unheard of for an ultra vires motion to take up so much council time and shows that our campaign has resonated with the Councilors. Most of them are angry that this legislation takes away their powers as local government but a lot of them are listening to us and see that we are concerned about excessive development without supporting infrastructure. They agree its not sustainable and this development of 175 houses + a small creche is just adding to the problem.
That said, we found a small number of Councilor's (all from the one party) comments about being '"either for housing or against it" and "anti-housing'" most disingenuous. The argument is more nuanced that that; Why would you double the size of the population and wait YEARS before putting the supporting facilities in? What reasonable person wants that? To be very clear, our group is pro-housing; pro- housing IN TANDEM with proper supporting community infrastructure. We are actively campaigning for a Cultural & Youth Center but we also support calls for other much needed community facilities - schools, childcare, health and retail facilities and will support any campaigns for these services.
Our argument is that we need FCC to allocate a site for this community facility now - before all FCC land is built upon. We have met with the Council senior management, made submissions in respect of the Urban Framework and have now submitted a detailed business plan to FCC management. We have a scheduled meeting in early May to discuss the business case and push to take this project forward. In the meantime, we will continue with our campaign and ask everyone in the community to get behind us.
I'm attaching our latest newsletter with details of our activities - we post frequently on social media so please like & share to get the word out to everyone and to keep up to date with our activities.
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- DPXRoad Infographic 2.pdf
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DonabateLad
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No bother, I'll be sending them an email too, particularly to Duncan. From watching the whole meeting it seems like they bought the council line that this was an anti-housing vote and didn't want to risk the negative PR for the Donabate community. It's not good enough for them to be having their cake and eating it too, all their councillors should have voted in support.Beenthere wrote: ↑15 Apr 2024, 19:52Thanks for that. Well FG did themselves zero favours there. I'm going to email Corina or Duncan for clarification on that because that seems very strange. All the noises coming from Corina and Duncan have been very pro that project. In fact if I remember correctly I went to that meeting about DP crossroads and they were 100% behind it. I followed it quite closely because my children would be very interested in it.DonabateLad wrote: ↑15 Apr 2024, 19:34You can see in the link I posted above.
Adrian Henchy abstianed (no surprise).
But Labour councillors Brian McDonagh and Brendan Ryan (retired from the Dáil but was co-opted onto the Council https://www.fingal.ie/news/cllr-brendan ... ty-council) abstained and James Humphreys voted against. I would expect them to vote as a bloc seeing as Duncan Smith seems to support the campaign.
Eoghan Dockrell is just a candidate atm but his one Fine Gael colleague at the meeting, Tom O'Leary, voted against the motion.
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DonabateLad
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Thanks for the detailed response and all the hard work the committee have been doing. There were some shameful comments from some of the councillors, particularly the Fine Gaelers.DPXRd2023 wrote: ↑15 Apr 2024, 21:02 The motion was not a typical Council motion in that any vote taken would be 'ultra-vires' meaning acting beyond your legal authority. Any vote taken on the issue was not going to count for anything or have any impact on Council plans. That's why some councilors who support our group abstained or voted no - it wasn't going to alter FCC management plans.
One point though, surely because this vote was 'ultra-vires', and wasn't legally binding, that frees those other Labour councillors to vote for this risk-free. If they're not going to support it under those conditions why would they support it, in the future, under higher-stakes when their vote actually matters? I understand that Corina is actively involved with the committee so that makes it even more disappointing that all her colleagues wouldn't support her and the Donabate community.
Our two Councillors were behind the idea of the Donabate Arts Centre being located in the old Credit Union building with further improvements to the Donabate Portrane Community Centre.
They now realise votes are to be gained by supporting Crossroads and the Tilberry site proposal
FCC after spending just under € 1 million to purchase the Credit Union with an additional spend of € 4 million to refurbish the building added to that a further € 2.5 million is to be spent on improvements to the Donabate Portrane Community Centre, I can understand why the other councillors voted No ... They want funding for their own projects and are probably saying the residents of the peninsula have had enough spent on them
Just imagine if € 7.5 million had been spent on a new Centre on Tilberry ??? Are we getting value for money from our present Councillors ... My answer would be NO
They now realise votes are to be gained by supporting Crossroads and the Tilberry site proposal
FCC after spending just under € 1 million to purchase the Credit Union with an additional spend of € 4 million to refurbish the building added to that a further € 2.5 million is to be spent on improvements to the Donabate Portrane Community Centre, I can understand why the other councillors voted No ... They want funding for their own projects and are probably saying the residents of the peninsula have had enough spent on them
Just imagine if € 7.5 million had been spent on a new Centre on Tilberry ??? Are we getting value for money from our present Councillors ... My answer would be NO
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DonabateLad
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That's just misinformation Mo. If you watch the Donabate Urban Framework Plan meeting you can see where our sitting councillors are at. Adrian introduced a motion for the expansion of the existing community centre while Paul M and Rob O'Donoghue had a joint motion on a standalone Arts centre. Paul M has supported the Crossroads campaign since it's beginning and works closely with the committee, to say otherwise is just letting personal bias cloud your judgement.Mo Kapav wrote: ↑16 Apr 2024, 09:03 Our two Councillors were behind the idea of the Donabate Arts Centre being located in the old Credit Union building with further improvements to the Donabate Portrane Community Centre.
They now realise votes are to be gained by supporting Crossroads and the Tilberry site proposal
FCC after spending just under € 1 million to purchase the Credit Union with an additional spend of € 4 million to refurbish the building added to that a further € 2.5 million is to be spent on improvements to the Donabate Portrane Community Centre, I can understand why the other councillors voted No ... They want funding for their own projects and are probably saying the residents of the peninsula have had enough spent on them
Just imagine if € 7.5 million had been spent on a new Centre on Tilberry ??? Are we getting value for money from our present Councillors ... My answer would be NO
You can view discussion on that motion, at the framework meeting here: https://fingalcoco.public-i.tv/core/por ... code=en_GB
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DonabateLad
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Mo... You're being very dishonest here. The Donabate Crossroads campaign was setup in October 2023, that motion from Paul M was 5 months before that... You might see it as a negative that councillors respond to local campaigns but I see that as a massive positive.